Saturday, July 25, 2015

Two killed/ 4 wounded Attack on Military Vehicle in Turkey

Two killed, four wounded as a result of an attack on a military vehicle in Turkey 

baku, Azerbaijan, July 26

Terrorists blew up a military vehicle which was carrying troops in the province of Diyarbakir, Turkey. As a result, two soldiers were killed, four wounded, Milliyet reported.
The wounded soldiers were taken to hospital.

Diyarbakir, Turkey- further east and deeper into Turkish territory- heading towards Iran
Interesting location

 Don't Miss, must read, with multiple updates:

Turkey: Creating "Safe Zones", Fighting for it's Survival, Turkey's letter to UN

 Turkey by all appearances is defending it's borders.
Turkey targeted brand ISIS from it's own airspace- Without entering Syrian airspace.

Question # 1: Why didn't/hasn't Turkey enter Syrian airspace?  
Is it because the US and company are in Syrian airspace? As they "fight ISIS"   While aiding Kurds in their ethnic cleansing of area residents.
If, we are supposed to believe Turkey is fighting alongside NATO allies- Why not enter Syrian airspace?

 "Turkey's operations will, if needed, continue until the terror organizations' command centers, all locations where they plan (attacks) against Turkey and all depots used to store arms to be used against Turkey are destroyed," the Turkish prime minister, Ahmet Davutoglu, said, confirming a “third wave” of attacks on Isil on Saturday and a second wave against the PKK.


Etc., etc.,

Necessary background:



  1. Penny,

    From an earlier comment you made. I agree that the Kurds helped kill thousands or possibly even tens of thousands of Armenians and other Christians, but that is still a rounding error when compared with the Turks. And Erdoghan is anti-Kurd to some degree, it is just that the priority was destroying Syria at all costs. What he really is is more of a supporter of an Ottoman Empire. However, there are always tactical issues in politics. The military regime before the AKP was virulently anti-Kurdish, so the AKP could promise to not put people in jail for speaking Kurdish. That kind of thing. Now, you have a party that gained a large number of seats in the parliament that is pro-Kurdish and really a coalition of various minority interests. This ruined things for him in the parliament, and something's got to give. His party goes, or another major party has to go. No coalition in the parliament can be formed. So who do you destroy? So don't be surprised if there are false flags or fake terror events that help Erdoghan. Nothing surprising in that. Whether NATO or Israel help in setting them up is another matter. Probably not, as he can't trust them.

    Also, I find the idea that Turkey is merely defending itself to be dubious. They were the key in destabilizing Syria as an invasion from Jordan or Lebanon wouldn't have been that threatening. They had decades to try to come to terms with the Kurds, and did make some slight progress. The Kurds in Syria were no problem for Turkey till Turkey sent in the killers. Some talk about Israel's bad karma, but one can make the case that it is far worse in Turkey. I talked to a number of Turks when there who were seriously afraid of their government's policies of radicalizing Islam and using it as a weapon to destroy Syria. Some of them had supported Erdoghan in the past, but thought he had brought the country to the verge of a disaster. It wasn't the Kurds who did that. The fragile situation inside Turkey could break, even without a big push by the US. All of Erdoghan's complaints about how the West is not helping with the millions of desperate refugees in Turkey is like the son who begged for mercy as an orphan in court for having killed his parents.

    Unfortunately, it looks grim. Turkey will likely be destabilized and a rotten Kurdish quasi-state will be created in Northern Iraq. A lot of these problems were likely inevitable, though, as the borders were so far from reasonable reality, and the attempts to create non-tribal systems, such as the Baath parties, were so opposed by the West and Israel, and the party apparatchiks were so corrupt.

    On a separate issue, more and more countries seem to be following in the West's press model of total lies when appropriate. As a minor example, the Azerbaijani press said that five Armenians soldiers and one Azerbaijani had been killed on their border. Later, we see that the Armenian authorities deny the whole thing. The Azerbaijani pretending to be a tourist from London on TV talking about the Eurogames in Baku was another nice example. When in doubt, lie. If questioned, lie more and bigger.


    1. Hi Paul;
      I will not disagree at all that Turkey played a role in destabilizing Syria

      But, which "Turkey"
      Deep State Turkey- Gulen & the CIA (recall early on in the destabilization it was CIA agents 'vetting' anti -syrian fighters'?)

      NATO occupied Turkey

      Or Turkey's elected gov?

      This is where pointing a finger at a geographical area becomes very complicated-

      If you accept the idea that Turkey will/is being destabilized why do you not accept the idea they are fighting to maintain their territorial integrity?

      As for the news story, it had just broke when I posted it. It should be simple enough to validate

  2. Paul- "I agree that the Kurds helped kill thousands or possibly even tens of thousands of Armenians and other Christians"

    And today the Kurds are killing more again. As Sunni Muslims, they kill alongside their Sunni Muslim bretheren in ISIS/L. As they did with the Turks. They certainly don't have clean hands (not talking the average person, because I myself don't want to be lumped in with the Canadian troops killing for no good reason)

    Which is why I suggest the Kurds that are killers/destabilizers/murderers don't make things any better for the Kurds that aren't.


    Interesting for sure

  4. Hi jo:

    Turkey's war on the Kurds realigns the Kurds with the Syrian government?
    It would be good, it could be helpful, but I'm not getting to excited yet.

    I left this comment, word for word at MoA
    If it ever appears???
    My comment below:

    "Last weeks suicide attack on a meeting of young, mostly Kurdish socialists attributed to the Islamic State was probably a false flag operation"

    The bomber that was identified was a Turkish Kurd-
    If factual, it was not likely a 'false flag' attack, but, was indeed ISIS, which has Kurds amongst it's ranks

    There never appeared to be any war plans by Erdogan- I followed that story and it went no where- Erdogan talked of securing borders and not much else, their appeared to be nothing to the 'war plan' talk

    "Erdogan's claim of attacking the Islamic State is only theater"

    Ok, you do know that shots were fired from Syria killing a Turkish soldier maybe 2? Which resulted in the retaliatory fire from Turkey, right?

    You are also aware that the PKK claimed the assassination hits on two police officers in Turkey, as they slept, right?

    Then there was another hit on two traffic cops at what appeared to be a staged accident- head shots, again.

    Then finally the attack you reference on the two soldiers..

    So, you are missing many occurences between between here and there

    You are also aware that Turkey went to the UN regarding the strikes on ISIS, right? While never once entering Syrian airspace?

    As for the offer of reconciliation from this Kurdish leader....
    While it might be a good idea, in theory, in reality I wouldn't get too excited as of yet

    There is much disagreement between the Kurds themselves- And NATO backed Kurds have been killing Kurds who are less then compliant..

    Considering also the fact that the Kurds have been ethnically cleansing Syrian Arabs and Christians- Same as in Iraq

    Facts that don't get covered even by so called alternatives such as MOA. And so many others

    Then of course there is the fact that Israel and the NATO allied Kurds are the best of buddies- And Israel long ago infiltrated into and trained the Kurdish fighters-- Israel wants nothing to do with Assad

    Kissing and making up- might be a bit difficult
    Not impossible, just difficult
    I'll refrain from jumping for joy at this time- but will hope for the best- For all ordinary humans concerned

    Posted by: Penny | July 26, 2015 at 03:20 PM

  5. This comment has been removed by the author.

  6. hi jo
    I also left this comment as a response to james
    b censors, I'm not sufficiently grovelling for his taste I guess?
    james @ 3

    "isn't the usa-israel plan to have a kurdistan? wasn't that all a part of the breaking up of iraq and this regime change in syria? turkey under erdogan seems to be easily duped into playing right into this plan too.. "

    It would seem Erdogan has caught on
    Israel would love a Kurdistan- it would be a home away from home for Israelis

    Posted by: Penny | July 26, 2015 at 03:23 PM

  7. and one more comment I left at MoA

    "The Syrian Kurds, all Kurds have been shafted by the U.S. they are not going to get a state"

    That meme is well worn- Why do the Kurds deserve a state?
    When so many others are stateless
    Syrians made stateless
    Iraqis made stateless
    Libyans made stateless
    Palestinians losing their state as we speak
    so many others- no place to call their own, but somehow the kurds deserve the state above all others

    If not for the media promoting that meme would anyone be regurgitating it thoughtlessly?

    What's interesting is both the self declared right and left push this meme- this mind virus crosses all indoctrination levels
    Which suggests widespread implantation
    Why did some organization, entity, agenda work so hard to spread that mind virus?

    Oh and one last thing?
    The Kurds are largely nomadic.. Do nomads ever really have a state?
    Or do they just have areas they 'hang out in'?"

    Posted by: Penny | July 26, 2015 at 06:06 PM

  8. Penny,

    The fact that the US is destabilizing Iraq, Syria, and many other countries is not particularly relevant as to whether the "mountain Turks" (as there is no such thing as a Kurd - as the Turkish government loved to say till recently) deserve a state. In any case, the issue is how to stop the disaster that is unfolding over in that part of the world. I think some form of autonomy is a reasonable compromise and also feel that the Turkish establishment is as rotten as Israel's, and see it as a way to lessen the overall evil in that part of the world. But we may disagree. Anyway, all nations are a form of compromise over history, language, religion, and regional cohesiveness, besides the issue of stronger nations wanting resources or strategic areas. However, the Kurds do pass many tests, such as numbers, regional cohesiveness, language, and history. One complicating factor is that minorities get killed or expelled in that part of the world. The voters in Scotland supposedly lost their attempt to gain independence, but they won't be shot, expelled, or arrested any time soon. A very different situation in the Middle East.

    As for which Turkey got involved in the war, I would say several. Mister Ottoman himself was the biggest enthusiast, but the entire NATO complex was right there with him. Actually, Erdoghan is said to have hesitated because he wanted promises that the West would do the job properly and smash Syria beyond all hopes of repair. He wisely didn't trust the Western criminals. However, once committed, he did become a big supporter.

    By the way, I kind of doubt that high of a percentage of Kurds were nomadic ten or fifteen years ago. What they have been is used and abused by the West to control Turkey or Iraq. Always thrown away when the time comes and then they pay a heavy price for falling for the West's lies. With the increasing nastiness, everybody is going to become a nomad. Syrians might have the second-highest nomad percentage, after Libya now. Do Syrians deserve a state if they are nomads? If they no longer should have a state because they move around a lot, who should get it instead? The guys who funded the problem that has caused them to move around so much? Let's hope not.


    1. Paul:

      In different circumstances I may agree the Kurds should have some sort of 'state' BUT... the only reason this is even on the table is because NATO wants this 'state'- that is very, very bad for the entire region. I would have figured you would understand this problem?
      Do you think that once the Kurds get this state there will be peace?
      There won't be. No more then there has been with Kosovo.

      " However, the Kurds do pass many tests, such as numbers, regional cohesiveness, language, and history."

      That's debatable- they practice a number of different religions and fight amongst themselves as to who is 'kurd' and who is not 'kurd' If they can't get that together a state will be a nightmare

      "Do Syrians deserve a state if they are nomads?"

      The Syrians weren't nomads until NATO began it's destabilization- They had families, extended and extensive, homes, apartments, land, farms etc., They deserve to go back home- Unequivocally IMO.
      The Kurds had homes too. In Syria. And when NATO came to town with their Gladio terrorists PKK and YPG Or YPD? whichever, they were some of the first refugees fleeing their terroristic brethren. Wow, they really gained from this mess.(facetious)

      Paul: "If they no longer should have a state because they move around a lot, who should get it instead? The guys who funded the problem that has caused them to move around so much? Let's hope not.'

      Odd then that you advocate for a kurdish state for willful nato participants in terror?

      Sorry, I really don't buy the victim Kurd meme. I just don't. The way it looks to me- the Kurds are the masters of their own misery.
      Their leadership is corrupt- They allied themselves with corrupt institutions.
      They were happy to kill with the Turks. Happy to kill alongside nato
      Happy to displace.
      And the average Kurd person is ignored, tossed aside for an agenda. The militant kurds have even killed non compliant kurds- You ignore all that?

      For the ordinary person, I have much empathy- but for those who chose to throw their support in with the larger terror state I have no sympathy.

      More turmoil does not make the world a better place, does it?

  9. btw Paul; Did you ever wonder where the "kurds deserve a state" meme came from?

    And why it's so broadly implanted vs a meme like say "Syrians for Syria" nation" Or "Libya, one nation, strong and proud"

    Perception management... Ask yourself where the idea for a Kurdish nation came from? Was it your own idea? Did you think it up, yourself? Would you or all the others who push this meme ever even have thought of this going about your day to day life?

    1. That meme came about after Gulf War I in 1991, when TV brought day in day out pictures of the poor displaced Kurds in the mountain of north Irak, because bad bad Sadam repressed them, yada, yada. Knowing now what I know about media, I see now what the purpose of that reporting was at that time.

  10. Penny,

    I don't have a dog in the race, unlike many who are very emotional on various sides of this topic. I thought the Kurdish (if we accept they exist at all) question was interesting 40 years ago, way before the current meme wars. As for the leadership being lousy problem, that is true of the Palestinians and many others. My point about Syrians being nomads because of being treated like dirt is also relevant, in my opinion, for the Kurds in Iraq and Turkey. They were subhumans in Turkey, and paid a high price for their political games in Iraq. So they got kicked around and became like all the homeless Syrian nomads I saw in Turkey. But the whole thing is political, not some wanderlust in the soul. Entire villages or even towns were cleaned out by the Turks as the Kurds were always seen as a threat.

    Yes, what NATO wants to do is bad, and that is why I suggested autonomy as a compromise instead of full independence. However, with things radicalized to a tremendous degree, that may not be possible. Another American triumph. But it is silly to deny the artificial nature of many of the states in that part of the world. The current borders seem way more ridiculous than the proposed ones in, say, a Clean Break. I don't want a clean break, I am just pointing out that the idea that, say, Libya is "one nation, strong and proud" is and was untrue. The Khadaffi clan made many mistakes, even though they did a great job in many ways. One way was treating Berbers in a less-than-satisfactory way, though the biggest stupidity was his son actually believing the lies of the West.

    Some people don't want to hear the above. It is the same story with the stupid borders in the former USSR. Put part of Armenia in Georgia, along with various other areas and half of Ossetia. Make a grand Ukraine out of everything. Intentionally mix all the borders of Central Asia. This was all great as far as making everyone go to Moscow all the time to work things out, as nothing could be done locally, but it was a recipe for endless war once the USSR went away. Well, similarly, now we are in a time when the center may not hold. Sure, it is a Western plot, but so was taking down the USSR. But one can make the argument that the lesson is to have rational borders, for there is no way to stop someone like Erdoghan, Netanyahu, or Nuland from wanting more power. Ain't gonna happen.

    As for the perception management, well, you don't have to ask. It is being hyped. Senator Rand Paul suggested the Kurds should get a state and other Republicans seem to be lining up that way, all for the good of Israel. So it is the usual suspects.

    As I said, I don't have a dog in the race, though I see the Turks as being what the Israelis should study to hone their techniques. It isn't a case of ignoring bad Kurdish behavior. The problem is that area is one where minorities are regularly killed or expelled or forced to enjoy the nomadic lifestyle.

    A separate, and perhaps more interesting, question is what will actually happen. Very complicated situation, with lots of possibilities. One is that Turkey will be destabilized from within. Not simply the Kurds, but the power blocs. The other is that the West may want to see KSA destabilized. Debatable, but possible.


    1. Hi Paul:
      I didn't think you had a dog in the race and I appreciate the discussion very much, because it does get me thinking and that, according to my husband is my problem, I think way, way, way tooo much!

      The Kurds should have worked towards some kind of autonomy, compromise, give and take within the countries they inhabited.

      And as a matter of fact they had some degree of autonomy within Syria and Iraq.. But, that wasn't good enough and here we all are today

      The entire planet witnessing this horrendous remake of the middle east
      Will the new borders be an improvement over these old borders?
      They won't because the new borders weren't worth the human and environmental destruction. And the 'new' borders will be designed to sow the seeds of future conflict

      There would certainly have been less painful ways of accomodating Kurdish aspirations, for all concerned- but, from what i have read their 'leaders' had other ideas, hence the situation we see today.

      I saw some information on recent polling done amongst the kurds- they had no nationhood aspirations, when polled.

      Leaders, power hungry ptb's and political manipulators with agendas have other ideas and they manipulate people into these horrific situations.

      I think you get the idea?

      What will actually happen? It appears Turkey finally realized their being double crossed- that situation has heated up immensely

      As for KSA- they will be destabilized, that's what I already see taking place- little happenings that we've all seen before

  11. "But one can make the argument that the lesson is to have rational borders, for there is no way to stop someone like Erdoghan, Netanyahu, or Nuland from wanting more power. Ain't gonna happen"

    You can't stop them from wanting the power however there is a way to deny them the means to carry out their evil plans and that lies with the people. No one leads if no one follows.
    People have to stop following "leaders" Leaders will always lead you in thee direction they want to go, not the direction you necessarily want to go.
    Until the masses wake up to that obvious fact we will always see people stealing the power of others for their own agenda