Tuesday, February 23, 2010

Joe Stack's daughter speaks

This is interesting. Joe Stack's adult daughter has done an interview

Asked whether she considered her father a hero, Stack's adult daughter, Samantha Dawn Bell, said during a telephone interview broadcast Monday on ABC's "Good Morning America"
"Yes. Because now maybe people will listen." But she stressed that his actions were "inappropriate."

"I think too many people lay around and wait for things to happen. But if nobody comes out and speaks up on behalf of injustice, then nothing will ever be accomplished"

She believes the reason Stack allegedly set his house on fire the morning of the attack is that

"We pay taxes on our home as well. My belief is that the house was part of the government. And I think he wanted to get rid of what was left."

"He stood up to the system," she added.

She later recanted her 'hero' statement.

"I don't want to hurt anybody," she told ABC. "We are mourning for Vernon Hunter," referring to the IRS investigator killed in the attack.
For obvious reasons. Someone died and that individuals family are not going to view her Dad as a hero.

That said, however she feels, she feels.

I notice the media is alternatively telling people what to think of this situation:
'While most Americans surely see Joseph Stack as an angry, misguided man whose final act"

and at the same time, linking Joe Stack to fringe, or racist groups.

It is not surprising Stack would be portrayed as a hero on fringe Web sites such as stormfront.org, a forum for white supremacists.
So, it is pretty clear the smear is on. As I said from the get go.


  1. As much as I love a conversation.
    I simply put this here as an update.
    If you want to talk about what his daughter said, her retraction, the media's use of 'guilt by assocation' for of smear, that is fine.
    Anything else, forget about it.
    The Bishop Bowman post is way more interesting.

  2. The more I read about this case, the more I think Doug had a point about it being a flase flag.

    I just came from a video from truthergirls


  3. Joseph Stack was nothing but a coward, to his family, to god, to our country. Boo, hoo, hoo, I have money problems and its not my fault, it the big bad government. Talk about a domestic terrorist who happens to be white trailer trash.

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  5. edo:
    so far, the letter is consistent with the story, with the actions of the individual.
    In fact the adult daughter bolsters the story in the interview she gave.

    as much as I do like the truther girls.

  6. yo penny:

    the letter and the alleged actions are consistent. I'm not disputing that.

    Joe Stack, fed up with losing his hard earned cash to the IRS all the time, still had plenty in the bank, and... he owned a plane! I don't know about you, but the only people I know that own planes are of the wealthy kind. I find that a bit odd. Don't you?

    Then there's the damage to the aptly named 'echelon' building. The story is now developing that Stack may have had additional fuel on board. But think about it, he ain't lifting that into a plane by himself, noway jose.

    Then there's the 'fire' in his home... Truthergirls are saying this went off at a time he 'must' have been away from the house, indicating remote or timed set off.

    I don't know about you, but again, why do that to his wife and kid? If his beef was with the IRS? Doesn't add up.

    Doug was pointing out that his daughter in Norway said it wasn't his writing (as reported by AP), then she (i presume its the same daughter) gives credence to it being him... That's quite a contradiction (or) a change of mind...

    Lots of questions still abound for me on this one...

    Doesn't change the fact the letter represents the sentiment of a significant proportion of the public, which probably means this story has a lot to do with 'communicating' with that sector of society....

  7. I was thinking about the explosion at the house, that could have easily been done by turning gas on, natural gas, then any old pilot light in the house will ignite the gas in the air.

    I actually saw the end result of this happen from a furnace pilot light and floor varnish/varathane when someone was redoing their floors.
    The fumes from the varnish/varathane built up, built up , until finally the pilot light ignited all the floors in the house.

    If the wife and daughter were not present the night before, could it have been because the husband put them up in a hotel the night before, knowing he was going to set fire to the home?

    I didn't want to go down this road, but, now I got to play devil's advocate ok edo?

  8. "It's not him. The letter itself sounds like it's coming from a different person," she said in an interview from her home in Norway.

    from AP.

    One sentence in an entire article.

    Which could have been proceeded by.
    He must not have been in his right mind when he wrote that.
    Or he must have been distraught.
    And as you said Edo, grief and shock can cause alot of denial.
    It's only one sentence.

    (This from a 9/11 truther edo)

    But, believe it or not this is what keeps me from getting involved with the no planes and laser weapons stuff.

  9. "I didn't want to go down this road, but, now I got to play devil's advocate ok edo?"

    ;-) That's fine Penny! I'm sure we can keep it civil.

    OK, so Stack keeps his family safe by putting them up in a hotel, but leaves them homeless at the same time... What a guy!

    Let's talk damage to buildings - This is of course a major tenet of conspiratorial discourse. Small plane, big, big damage. Windows blown 'out' well away from the impact zone. Fires, huge. The MSM is saying this is due to additional fuel taken on board (as one drum of fuel was missing from the airport). I wonder how much fuel that was, and how the heck he got it onto his plane... Before long they'll be saying it wasn't additional fuel but a bomb, you watch... Then we're supposed to believe that as well as being a software engineer, Joe Stack is also quite handy with making incediary devices...

    What's your view on the damage Penny? Consistent Still?

  10. I was waiting for the building to collapse myself.

    The plane size, relative to the building size, thinking of 9/11 should have seen a complete collapse.

    Cripes the building was only seven stories. The trade towers were more then 100 stories (over 1000 feet tall)

    As for his family, are suicidal people known for being considerate?
    I mean they kill themselves, and hurt their families immensely.

    here is another story, cripes I am just full of them today.

    Well this one my daughter told me,
    at her place of employment, mom and son work together, son goes home for lunch, hangs himself in the bloody house, guess who goes home and finds the body, yup, poor mom, who is devastated right before christmas.
    People who kill themselves are not known for thinking of others.

  11. btw edo, If something else comes out that causes me an aha sort of moment, I will be the first to admit it, but, right now, I am just not there.

  12. I don't know if it's an AHA moment I had myself... more of an hmmmmm moment.

    Although I hate to admit it, this article on prisonplanet is pretty compelling for an AHA moment...


  13. Joe stack had the moxy to take a stand. I spent a decade watching over you folks as you slumbered. Tyranny is not a story book fable. If the body count from Iraq hasnt waken you then the monetary damage / stress is about to really hit every one, you think this economy is going to rebound with your interest in mind. The road to economic salvation is up to small buisness? Small buisness responds with a divine wind attack? Joe Stack did just what our wise founding fathers did they made a violent stand. What?:are you foolish enough to think that innocent people didnt die during our revolution? War is hell. Go back to the latest news on Tiger everything is fine. Go back to sleep the government will make it allllllll beter sweetie.

  14. Like it or not the truth is that a minority of wealthy run the world they are not gonna give up what they have without a fight. I cant condone Joes end but, really folks when are we gonna put our foot down? How many sons and daughters more are we going to sacrifice in the mid east? Kick in the draft, boys & girls all go; then keep you on as reserves until your 50 years old, works good in Israel when you have your life at stake you are more likely to PARTICIPATE in your country's course. If not youll get the government you deserve. The whole world hates us for a reason. We have the best country on this planet and were squandering it all by apathy.

  15. Well there you go. It was only a matter of time.

    "Kick in the draft, boys & girls all go; then keep you on as reserves until your 50 years old, works good in Israel when you have your life at stake you are more likely to PARTICIPATE in your country's course."

    Are you for real dude? That statement is wrong on so many levels.

    apt word verification = mulin
    (do you think he's watching?)

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  17. well Edo, those were some interesting comments,no?

    'mulin' eh?

    Edo, how would the government benefit from this act?

    With 9/11 they got their war on in Afghanistan, Iraq and their foothold in the ME, Eurasia, every move was justified by 9/11.
    Every abuse, every restriction, what was the benefit to be attained from this?

    I'll check out the link, ty

    oops and I forgot after 9/11, right after 9/11- patriot act.

    After underwear bomber- and I mean right after- naked body scanners

  18. You can usually tell false flag ops from the reaction of the government. First of all, its immediate.They are finger pointing within hours if not minutes and have evidence (they say) implicating the culprit(s).

    The restrictive regulations or the laws they want to implement are already prepared and waiting to put in place. The governments reaction is swift and co-ordinated i.e. planned and obviously so.

    I don't see any of that with Joe Stack's effort. Indeed, the delayed and piecemeal response is what you would expect if they were caught off guard. Most people involved would be waiting on instructions from on high on how to treat it.

  19. Awh Geez, Yuh know maybe the man was just plain pissed off, no bells, no whistles just pissed off. Has anyone ever stopped to consider this aspect of this story?

    And as for him having his own plane and therefore he must have cash coming out of his ears. Well firstly it's not mentioned what year the plane was and I know for a fact that I can pick up a 1975 Piper Cherokee in great shape for around 40 grand. A new pickup truck these days sells for around 50 thousand or more, is it only the very rich that drive pickups, hell just look at the Harley's on the road these days, they ain't cheap. So just because Stack owned a plane says nothing.

    I fly a Piper Seneca and by the reasoning of some people I must be in there with the Rockefeller's and I assure you that I am not.
    Never is it stated when he bought the plane, from whom he bought the plane or how much he paid for the plane. If Stack had crashed a Winnebago into the building would that have made him any less rich? Lots of Winnebago's on the road, all driven by millionaires? because there are a lot of Winnebago's out there that cost more than that plane ever did. But I guess crashing a motor-home into a building doesn't have quite the panache of flying a small plane into one. Even if Stack had used a motor-home loaded with av-gas,it would have done a lot more damage but it would hardly have hit the evening news and we wouldn't be discussing it now.

    So lets get real, maybe he was just an angry man making a statement.

    Of one thing you can be sure, whether this was orchestrated by the Government of the US or not they will milk this this for every last drop that they can get out of it, and so will the Canadians.

  20. "and have evidence (they say) implicating the culprit(s)."

    I should add that by 'culprit' I don't mean the the person who actually carries out the bombing or whatever (Stack in this case) but rather I mean the group that the government wants to smear and hold responsible for the enactment of restrictions. This hasn't happened. It may happen in the near future but that would indicate to me that they are taking advantage of the circumstances (as you would expect) rather than having planned it.

    If you want to use a 'terrorist' act for a specific purpose, you need to follow through with that purpose quickly while people are still in shock and not thinking straight. Hence the immediate response.

  21. this damage

    but check this..

    I for one, ain't buying that.

  22. Hey Silv,

    I know my comment about his finances is a weak point.

    But I've yet to hear anything from you guys on the ability to carry additional fuel on one of these planes, or the extent of the damage to the building. Seeing as you're a pilot and have experience in these matters, do you have any ideas how Stack could have gotten additional fuel on board, and how much?

    I'll gladly concede his finances have little relevance.

    For the record, I have flip flopped over this as you will see by my comments on Penny's previous post.

  23. If I had any money, and I'm not a betting man, I would bet every nickle that this was an inside job - if it could be determined with 100 % certainty whether it was or not.

    I also think that almost no one will be with me on this.

    I think his daughter or other family is probably too confused to shed any light on this. I think the letter speaks for itself, I need to look no further in making this call.

    I think it may be one of those things where it isn't supposed to be obvious that it was an inside job, unlike OKC, 9/11, London 7/7 or the underwear bombing - we were supposed to see that these were inside jobs. You'd have to be a moron not to see false flag nature of past events. Not so in this case.

  24. Edo, this is hardly a cargo plane , the 180 piper Cherokee carries 45 gal of fuel max, plus 200 pounds cargo max, that would be around twenty gal of fuel in the cargo bin, so where would the EXTRA fuel be stored? with a maximum load of some 969 pounds and saying that Stack weighed in at perhaps 180 that would leave 789 pounds for cargo aka some extra fuel, and this would go precisely where? In the rear passenger compartment perhaps , but how much and how would it be put there, in gallon jugs perhaps?

    If you had ever been in one of these aircraft you would know that to get in the back seat it's shoe horn your ass time, there just isn't a lot of room so a barrel of fuel is out of the question, so lets say he loaded a bunch of milk jugs that by the way take up a lot of room. And even if he had done this who would have known? the containers would have burned up almost instantly. So how is it known if indeed he was carrying extra fuel and how much? This puzzles me.

  25. silverfish:
    the extra fuel is being reported as speculative as far as I can see.

    Texas pilot may have loaded Plane extra fuel.
    Is the most common headline associated with it.

    Also a link to a photo after the plane flies in, and you can see, there is not alot of intitial damage from the plane impact

    However, after the fire is put out, of course there is signs of charring and there is extensive water damage at this point in time also.

  26. I've flown in small planes like this - no reason Stack couldn't have just carried the extra fuel and put it in the back.

    The one I was in and flew was $15000.00. (I was too chicken to land so the pilot did it). (Pilots are too chicken to let me do my arial maneuvers do were even)

  27. Dougie, I'm so disappointed that the pilot didn't allow you to play lawn dart. $150,000 Oooooo I'm Soo impressed. Now I've flown IN many planes even like a 747 that tills out at some 37 million so what the hell was your point exactly? Or where you just doing aerial maneuvers between your ears AGAIN Hmmmm.

  28. I think he said $15,000 Silv...
    (to make the point you did earlier about flying not necessarily being a rich man's game)

  29. .... but I could be wrong!

    As I may well be about Joe Stack.
    You've all brought very convincing arguments to the table.... and I think I'm just going to have to stay undecided.

  30. Silverfish wrote-
    "Or where you just doing aerial maneuvers between your ears AGAIN"


    you've made my day, Silv. Still laughing!

  31. "Dougie, I'm so disappointed that the pilot didn't allow you to play lawn dart. $150,000 Oooooo I'm Soo impressed. Now I've flown IN many planes even like a 747 that tills out at some 37 million so what the hell was your point exactly? Or where you just doing aerial maneuvers between your ears AGAIN Hmmmm."

    I think that what number I said was clear. If anyone has trouble, I suggest going to the library and getting yourself a grade six math book and looking up decimal points and fractions.

    I don't come on here to trade insults. At least read my post before insulting me, else you look stupid.

  32. James, you're an idiot for laughing with one.

  33. But it's funny, Doug! Why aren't you happy for me? Without you and Silv I wouldn't have this big cheese eating grin on my face.

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  35. James, Silv,It may sound like I am doing arial maneuvers between my ears to those that do not understand. But I am not, I have studied Marxism and the law, you obviously have not. You just throw your unstudied opinion around like its equal to the studied opinions such as mine and make stupid jokes for fun. Its what people call "verbal diarrea" when words like yours are spoken.

  36. Just to lighten the conversation somewhat, but keep it on track, I thought I'd share this clip from 2008. Joe Stack wasn't the only angry one.



  37. Edo, omg, that is hilarious.

    but, hey,despite the colourful language and hillbilly aura, the guy is aware.

  38. "wooooh, that's that fire baby, that's that fire!"